#460 – Affiliate Armies, Viral Videos, & the TikTok Shop Playbook with Tommy Lynch
Tommy Lynch, the creative force behind Cult Content, joins us to share his extraordinary journey from crafting furniture at just 15 to becoming a social commerce marketing maestro. As we explore the vibrant landscape of TikTok Shop and e-commerce, Tommy reveals the blend of patience and tenacity required to overcome the hurdles of slow sales and costly shipping. His tale is a testament to resilience, navigating through early Amazon-like tactics to gain traction and establish his niche in the e-commerce space.
Embark on Tommy’s adventurous transition from almost being banned from school premises to embracing a nomadic lifestyle, living out of a bus while traversing 35 states. The story turns from his initial sales roles to an unexpected career in content creation and freelancing. By harnessing the power of networking, Tommy’s path led him to collaborate with brands, beginning with a hard seltzer company and eventually finding his footing in LA. His narrative underscores the profound impact of building genuine connections while highlighting the adaptability needed to thrive in both creative and entrepreneurial pursuits.
Dive into the strategic world of digital marketing as Tommy shares insights on leveraging TikTok’s potential to drive e-commerce success. From working with major brands like Infinity Hoop to the birth of his own agency, Cult Content, he uncovers the secrets behind crafting viral-worthy content and the importance of a strong hook. Explore the unpredictable dynamics of the TikTok shop environment, the strategic use of affiliates, and how creating a community can lead to transformative growth. Whether you’re an aspiring content creator or an established marketer, there’s something for everyone in Tommy’s compelling story.
In episode 460 of the AM/PM Podcast, Kevin and Tommy discuss:
- 00:00 – TikTok Shop and E-Commerce Journey
- 05:52 – Living in a Converted School Bus
- 09:26 – Bus Traveler Turned Content Creator
- 14:39 – Content Creator Brand Partnerships and Pricing
- 20:00 – Unlocking TikTok Shop’s Money-Making Potential
- 25:56 – Creating Viral Video Content Strategy
- 30:43 – Building ‘Cult Content’ Agency Success
- 32:54 – Key Takeaways From Event Presentations
- 38:08 – Challenges of Becoming a Creator
- 43:52 – Setting Expectations for TikTok Advertising
- 44:45 – Strategies for TikTok Shop Success
- 53:42 – Getting Started on TikTok Shop
- 55:47 – TikTok Shop Platform and Sales Strategies
- 1:00:11 – Marketplaces’ Regulatory Evolution for New Platforms
- 1:06:06 – The Power of Social Commerce
Transcript
Kevin King:
Welcome to episode 460 of the AM/PM podcast. This week we’re talking TikTok shop, what it takes to actually deal with affiliates and creators, and how to get started. If you haven’t even started, how do you get those first views or those first buys going? Some of the tactics that people are using behind the scenes, kind of like the old days of Amazon. We’ve got Tommy Lynch from Cult Content on and that’s what we’re going to be discussing. He’s got an interesting story, I think you’re going to like, especially one about a little school bus. So, enjoy this episode with Tommy Lynch. Tommy Lynch, how are you doing man? Good to have you on the AMPM podcast. How’s it going?
Tommy:
Doing good, Kevin. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. I appreciate you bringing me on.
Kevin King:
So, for people that don’t know what’s your story, man, how long have you been doing this e-commerce stuff?
Tommy:
So, I guess I’ve been in e-commerce I mean, if you count, when I was a young, I guess probably like a decade. So, when I was, um, when I was 15, I started a pallet furniture business, and so, you’ll actually see, I built that headboard. This is like my bed frame. It’s all built out of recycled shipping pallets. And so when I was 15, I would take apart these pallets and I would sell them at the farmer’s market, and then I would also sell them on my website, um, and then from there I got into like print on demand Etsy shop. I had that going for a little bit, and then it wasn’t until after I graduated college or graduated high school. I moved into a school bus that a friend and I had bought and I needed like a job that I could do from the road. So I was like, oh, I’ll become like a content creator, marketer, sort of freelancer, and so I was doing that for a while. And then, uh, about two years ago, I really was like, okay, I need to move in more into like the agency space, and so that’s what I’m doing now is building cold content.
Kevin King:
So wait, we got it. We got to go back to 15. Where are you like? I deal with a lot of pallets and I hate getting rid of these things. I get shipments come in, like I have a. One of my businesses is calendars and so it’s seasonal. So every August I get tons of freaking pallets coming in and I store them in the warehouse. And I got to get rid of these damn pallets because it’s a public storage unit where I store them and I don’t keep it year round. I just keep it seasonal for that particular business. So these pallets I’m like I know you can call somebody and they’ll come pick them up or they’ll come get them for you. Some people will buy them from you. But I usually just go find a construction site that’s like something where they’re building a new neighborhood and they got those big. You know they make those temporary trash cans in the front yards that have like a wood around them. I’ll just dump them in there. But so at 15, where were you getting the pallets?
Tommy:
I would get them from, like my high school or like it was, you know, either the high school, the middle school. There was, like some, behind like a home goods. I would just find them and-
Kevin King:
Like just discarded ones, or you had an arrangement with them to go pick them up.
Tommy:
Uh, sometimes both like they’d be discarded. And then there’s also like there was a brewery where I’d pick them up from and I knew the like one of the guys working at the brewery, and so I’d pick pallets up from there.
Kevin King:
And then bring them back? Did you have a shop somewhere? Or you’re doing this, your garage or your parents’ house, or where were you, where were you making this furniture?
Tommy:
My parents’ garage. I would take them apart and like, do it in the yard and cut it up with, you know, circular saws and all that and uh-
Kevin King:
Oh wow!
Tommy:
Yeah, and so it was a fun time.
Kevin King:
It was a fun time.
Tommy:
It was a fun, creative endeavor too, because I was making it and selling it and that was I don’t know. I definitely learned because there were times when I’d be at the farmer’s market and it would be like several weeks straight where I wouldn’t make a single dollar, like I’d make barely enough to cover the fee to be there, like in the market, and learning that at like 15 and learning the patience where it’s like I was there, I was showing up, I was giving it my all, putting my you know blood, sweat and tears into this furniture and then I’d be like barely you know making, making any sales with it and I’d be like dang, like that’s. That’s hard and it would piss me off, but like I’m glad I went through that because then I’ve learned to like that patience that’s really really required, to like make any business work so.
Kevin King:
So then you said you sold them on Etsy and on other places you’re, so you were shipping these big wood things to people.
Tommy:
Basically, yeah, it was expensive. I remember I got one order through my, through my store, and it was to like North Carolina and just the shipping on it was like a hundred bucks because it was an end table, big, bulky, heavy end table.
Kevin King:
Yeah.
Tommy:
Um, and so it I ended up, uh, not like sometimes I I like wonder, like if I were to have stuck with it, like where would I have gone? And I think I would have had to go into like really polished, like super nice high-end furniture still like doing the rustic recycled stuff, but like and then selling pieces for, like you know, two, three, four, five thousand dollars to like interior designers or that kind of thing um.
Kevin King:
Look so during this whole process, you sold one-
Tommy:
Online. online.
Kevin King:
Online.
Tommy:
I sold more um at the farmer’s market, so I’d be there sitting there all day every weekend selling it.
Kevin King:
Oh cool. So, then you said next you. When you graduated high school, you went and lived in a bus?
Tommy:
I did.
Kevin King:
You guys had converted vans to like these travel routes. Y’all converted an old school bus to like a little apartment or something.
Tommy:
Basically, yeah. So when I was, because I was in high school, during COVID, and so, okay, COVID came my junior year of high school and they, you know, they basically canceled school. And so a friend and I we were. We were out messing around in the middle school parking lot one one evening, as you do, and, um, we were looking at these buses and we’re like dang, I like I wonder how much you could get a school bus for. And so we looked it up that night and it’s like they’re selling like these used school buses for like a couple thousand dollars. And so then then that got the cogs turning. I was like, okay, we could like, if we both get jobs working at the Safeway and save up some money and buy, you know, buy a school bus. Like we could actually do this in a couple months. And so then we, that’s what we ended up doing, and we got a bus for three grand 35-foot school bus, um, and then-
Kevin King:
Old yellow school bus. This one was old, yellow like school bus that said something X, Y, Z, I, S, D on the side or something.
Tommy:
Yeah, exactly, it was the, it was Loudon County public schools and we bought this old bus and when we, when we had it, like there’s still stuff in there, like, if you like, if you reach between like the cracks, between some of like the storage spots, like you’ll find um, like notes that like kids had left for, like the bus driver, like a decade ago, like two decades ago, how you know who knows how long, um, but it’s, it’s funny. And so we got that. And then, you know, put a-
Kevin King:
Strip out all the seats and everything?
Tommy:
Yeah, took out all the seats, put solar panels on it, put a tv in there, an Xbox 360, um, you know bed, all the, all the good stuff. And so that was the spot, like that was the hangout spot during, you know, uh, senior year, um and then-
Kevin King:
Did you drive this bus around the country, or did you just stay in one spot, basically, and that was your, like your apartment?
Tommy:
It was it, so I’d actually been parking it in the middle school parking lot, because my house, my parents house, backs up to uh, this middle school and oh okay, okay, same middle school I went to. So I parked the bus there and when it wasn’t painted, it was great because, like you know, no one would hassle us cause it looked like a yellow school bus in the school parking lot. Like it just sort of belonged there, Um, but then eventually, like we, we had to, had to move it. Um, there was a funny. A funny story I have, I guess, is like one afternoon, you know, my buddy and I were hanging out, um, and I got a call and someone had left a voicemail. And I’m like listening to the voicemail and it’s like a police officer had left this voicemail on accident, like it was like some kind of butt dial almost, because I’d left my phone number on the window of the bus, um, and so he, he’s calling, he’s oh yeah, there’s a bunch of freaks out here. We, you gotta, we’re gonna have to call the tow truck and we’re going to get this bus out of here. And I was like, oh, like I got to, I got to go. So I like run over to the middle school and they sit me down, and so there’s like two school security officers and two Fairfax County police officers and they’re like telling me like, oh, we got a call, someone reported seeing a naked person and like, because I had, I’d come back from a camping trip and so, like my shirt was dirty I had like no shirt on at the time and so like someone had made a call and was like, oh, there’s like some creep in the middle school parking lot and so I show up and I’m like no, no, no.
Tommy:
And they sat me down. They were like going to arrest me and be like oh, you can’t go on school property anymore, all this stuff. And so I was like, okay, if I’m getting banned from all school property, do I still go to high school? And they were like, well, what do you mean? I was like, well, I go to Edison High School just down the road. Like you can’t ban me from all school property. And then they were like, oh, okay. And so eventually and I was also when I was in middle school I was like friends with the, I guess, principal because I ran like this 4-H club, and so they ended up calling the middle school principal at the time and he was like, oh yeah, Tommy, he’s, he’s cool, he can park the bus there. So let’s go.
Kevin King:
Oh man, so the bus were you. Were you sleeping in or were you still sleeping at your parents house?
Tommy:
I was sleeping at my parents’ house at the time. It was like a party place, yeah, just sort of a kickback spot, you know, take it camping, that kind of thing. And then, you know, a year, year or two goes by. I work a couple of jobs, some sales jobs. I’m like I want to do something else. I tried to launch a party bus business. I figured I have the bus. I bought my friend’s half of the bus because we had split it. Then I was going to launch this party bus business where I pick up business groups and take them to wineries or do whatever wedding parties. I was way too young to actually get insured. No one wanted to insure a 19-year old with a party bus.
Kevin King:
I can’t even drink, yeah legally drink.
Tommy:
Yeah, and I wasn’t even old enough to get my you know like interstate cdl, and so there was like that challenge too, and so then I was like okay, can’t get insured, I guess I’ll just live in the bus, travel around and make TikTok videos for businesses. And that’s when I got started into the you know TikTok space.
Kevin King:
And so the where were you? Where were you based? Where was the middle school? Was that California or somewhere else?
Tommy:
That was Virginia.
Kevin King:
Virginia okay.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
So then you headed out of Virginia and what did you do? Like around the US, or just the Northeast?
Tommy:
Yeah, I did. I hit like 35 states. And so I went north first, did all the Northeast, then I went through the Midwest, then, you know, the Western states. I ended up sort of crash landing LA, where a buddy of mine from high school was living at the time and, um, he was pursuing a career as a youtuber. Now he actually is a youtuber, he’s got like one and a half million subscribers and he flies around the world making videos, and so I ended up sort of staying with him for like another six months and then I took the bus back out here um, okay, right now.
Kevin King:
So so, as you’re traveling on the bus, you’re like I’m just trying to follow the mindsets. You’re like I gotta make a little bit of money here. Um, so you’re going online and you’re posting videos about your bus lifestyle and like, here I am in front of Grand Canyon, here I am in front of uh, whatever. And then some people start saying like, hey, will you make videos for us? Or did you go out and start like using that as like proof? Like, hey, I, I’m doing these videos. Would you like to advertise or would you like me to do them for you? Walk me through how that process worked.
Tommy:
So I had some business connections when I left, so I was in because I was doing this credit card processing sales job and I was in a BNI Business Networking International if you’re familiar with that, it’s a lot of home services and that kind of stuff and, um, I’ve made sort of friends with this, uh, realtor and realtor coach and he, you know he would get on calls and so it started as just like me, chopping up his content and, um, you know, making making videos out of that, adding subtitles, music, whatever.
Kevin King:
Using CapCut or Premiere?
Tommy:
I was Premiere Pro. Yeah, doing it all on Premiere. And so I started with him and he was paying me $1,000 a month and I was living on the bus and I would do that and then I would also make my own content, you know, about living on the bus and traveling and whatever. And then I didn’t really get more once I got to LA. Then I was like, okay, let me settle down, let me get some more clients figure out more on the business side. And I was still, you know, freelancer, content creator, um, but that’s when I got more involved with, like product brands and that kind of stuff. And that was all.
Kevin King:
After when you met your buddy and saw what he was doing, he kind of inspired you or helped, helped kind of send you in the right direction.
Tommy:
Uh, pretty much, yeah, he actually handed off one of my first like real clients. Um, he was working for this brand called Passion Tree. Uh, it’s a hard seltzer brand in California, I think, a couple other States, um, and he had been making content for them, you know, not no, like real results, but they were paying him like a good little bit and he wanted to focus on YouTube and so he was like you can take over, like this, this passion tree brand, and so I started doing stuff for them. You know, got them 10 million views or something like that, 10,000 followers and that was like one of my first real like. Oh, like I’m actually. I’m actually doing this like for brands.
Kevin King:
So and so, that are you still doing stuff for them today or is it moved on?
Tommy:
No, so they, they hired a different ginger. It’s messed up. Um, they, they had someone internal start making content. Um, and so when I, when I really started, and so I’ve generated like 50 million views for brands, and that was all like me as a content creator, and so I came into this space from a marketing angle, from a content angle how do we get product brands? And that was all before TikTok Shop had even rolled out, and so then, as time went on, it sort of changed, so I started just making content for brands. I had another uh account client called the new calendar. It was a calendar with nine days a week. Um, yeah-
Kevin King:
Okay.
Tommy:
It’s like really my uh. Every time I talk about it with my dad he says it’s like trying to sell a, a car with square wheels because it’s like it’s this whole new system of, like you divide time differently. 365 can only be divided by seven, or it’s a, I think it’s like. I don’t know I forget how the math works out, but basically it’s a calendar that divides time evenly is the idea, and so I got them again. Like another maybe 20 million views, um, and like 20 nothing crazy in sales. Like 20,000 in sales, I think, um and so I work with them.
Kevin King:
Yeah, the view is probably more just curiosity, people, what the hell is this? Then they are gonna be like yep, I’m in. I believe there’s a nine day week.
Tommy:
It was honestly like a funny uh product for TikTok, I think, like because it was such like a unique thing, it got a lot of engagement. It got a lot of comments, a lot of people being like, oh, that’s so stupid, like no one’s ever gonna use a nine day a week calendar, like that kind of thing. Um, which is-
Kevin King:
Is that company still around, or or are they?
Tommy:
Not really, and it was like it was. So it was my mom’s, uh, cousin’s husband, and so I’d actually known about this calendar since I was like 15 years old or something. He’d been working on it. It was like his brainchild and um, but he I don’t think he’s done much with it recently, um,.
Kevin King:
That’s great, that’s great.
Kevin King:
Right. So how does it work when you go to a brand, when you’re doing this? Would you just have a flat rate and say, hey, my rate’s a thousand bucks a month, or it’s 500 bucks a video, or it’s X amount plus a percentage of sales? What was your methodology back when you were doing that? Or I don’t care I just need some mac and cheese and some diesel for me.
Tommy:
Yeah. Basically that was more how it went. Usually it would be per video and so I was doing 20 videos a month for the new calendar, and then I would get deals on Upwork too, because I was still freelancing. So I’d find someone and I’d be like, oh yeah, I can make videos about your, you know, whatever product, and, um, you know, it’ll be a hundred bucks a video and I sort of, for a little while I was like I gassed myself up because I, um, I got to the point where I was charging like between like 150 to 200 bucks a video, you know. And then, and then I found a client, the Infinity Hoop, um, and so they reached out to me on Upwork and this was this was like my first time working with like a big brand and they did, uh, I mean, they’re a seven-figure brand, uh, actually eight figures. They had done like 13 million dollars in sales the first year that I worked with them and they wanted me to you know same thing, making a bunch of content, and I was doing like three videos, three videos a day for them. Um, and that’s when I realized because, like the guy, Leo Ichiano, um, he sort of showed me like what he had going on and like the net, like it. That opened my eyes as to like what was possible with TikTok shop and, like all the different lovers, you know how important that affiliate piece is, um. And then from there I was like, okay, let me find a way to provide more value than I am currently.
Kevin King:
So these videos playing on your channel or on his channel, or on both?
Tommy:
Yeah, so it was always brand content.
Kevin King:
The ads behind it. Okay.
Tommy:
Yeah, it was always brand content. I was never I’ve never actually been an affiliate. I don’t have, like, a TikTok affiliate account. I was right from the get-go. I was posting like creating content for brand pages.
Kevin King:
Okay, and so you did that. And then what? What was different about the TikTok? So when you said it opened your eyes to TikTok shop, you didn’t, you didn’t realize how much money could be made selling products off of the videos, or what was it that, uh, opened your eyes there?
Tommy:
Well, it was it. It was more like I didn’t realize what the path forward looked like and how to really utilize the TikTok ecosystem, if that makes sense, because I was coming from a spot of like oh, I know how to make videos and I can make viral videos. I know how to make content. Let me just keep making content. Um, and I had to really learn that, although content is king and you know content is currency, all of that it’s like that’s not, it’s not just a matter of content. You, you have to have affiliates, you should be running paid ads. There’s a lot more that goes into strategy, especially launching on TikTok shop than, um, than just content.
Kevin King:
You have to have a product that people want too. You look at the nine-day calendar uh, nine week, a nine week day a week, and whatever it’s called. And um, you said you got what? 50 million views or 20 million views or whatever. It was some crazy number of views and they sold 20,000 worth.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
So there’s a. That’s where a lot of it’s not just about the virality. Everybody’s like I want to go viral, I’ll go viral. Sometimes you don’t want to go viral because actually going after these smaller niches where there’s product market fit is actually better than something that goes viral and everybody’s just commenting like this is crazy. Or look at his hair, he needs to get a haircut or whatever stupid stuff they’re putting in there. So that’s an important aspect that I think a lot of sellers miss or don’t quite understand. They’re always looking for the Kim Kardashians or the big people that can make it go viral, and that’s not necessarily what you want to do.
Tommy:
Yeah, and it’s not. You have to have a holistic approach, because there’s something to be said about going viral. There’s something to be said about having a million people view your product and then you know however many product pages you get. And then, like there is, going viral is generally a good thing, right and um, but that is something that I had to learn where it’s like, that doesn’t mean that you’re just going to have an insane number of conversions. You have to have content for every sort of step of that funnel. Like do you have to have videos that can can go viral, but you also have to have videos that are like going to perform in ads and are going to drive conversions and are tailored to actually, you know, convert at like the bottom of the funnel.
Kevin King:
What do you see that makes, helps make something go viral, and all the viral videos that you’ve done is there. Is there a? Is it just potluck and just throwing enough videos out there? Or is there something that you do that kind of juices the algorithm that gives it a much better chance of going viral? Or is it something that’s off the wall where, like, people are commenting and because there’s so much comments and engagement, that helps it go. What, what are? What are you seeing that uh, that helps, helps with that?
Tommy:
So, I mean generally to go viral, there’s it’s really like a couple of key metrics right. Number one it’s like the viewer retention how much are people actually watching the video? Because if they’re swiping away after like a hook, you know if they, if the hook doesn’t catch them, they don’t watch the video. If they’re like TikTok’s not going to push it. Now, if you-
Kevin King:
Explain to those listening that might not know what a hook is I mean, I know, but just for those listening what? What’s a, what’s a hook or a way to set up a video?
Tommy:
So you have to think when you’re thinking about content and you’re thinking about TikTok’s and short form content especially right. People are just scrolling and if they don’t stop to watch your video, then your video won’t get pushed out, so they’re just scrolling and they, within the first three seconds, they’re deciding am I going to keep watching this video or am I going to scroll to the next one? And if you don’t give them a reason to keep watching within that first three seconds, they’re probably going to scroll to the next one, and so that’s. I mean, that’s ultimately the first. That’s the first thing that you have to do is what is your hook? What is like, what reason are you giving the viewer to keep watching? From there you need to deliver on that and continuously deliver on that. So, you hook them right. And when I’m talking about this in the context of a product, right, usually we want to go viral within a certain niche, right, it’s like I’m looking to reach middle-aged men who have blood flow issues or whatever, and so like we’re going to have a hook that drives to the emotionality of that and get someone to who is experiencing those problems to stop scrolling.
Tommy:
Um, and then part of that is visual. So, like one of the affiliates that I have, um, you know he’s selling this, this product, it’s capsules. But like he starts the video with like a syringe like in his butt and he’s like got his you know, half his pants pulled down because like that’s gonna stop someone and be like oh what, like what am I watching? Right, it gives them some questions. Then from there you’re talking about like the sort of you know, depending on how viral you’re trying to go and what you’re actually trying to do, like I generally think it’s good to go from there like that hook into the problem that the product is solving. So if it’s blood flow, like maybe you’re talking about you know like ED not performing in the bedroom, or you’re talking about you know like whatever, whatever that problem is, and then you just structure that to go right into the solution of those.
Kevin King:
So the way he structures that with a needle is that that stops them, because people are like what the heck? like you said, and then then he takes that like yeah, needles are gross, you don’t need to do that, I’ve got these capsules, you don’t ever have to punch a needle, so you segue or use that. Yeah, that’s what you’re kind of talking about.
Tommy:
We’re just yeah, exactly so you have. It has to be, um, you have to have a video that makes sense from start to finish and like you sort of have to hold the hand of the viewer from the beginning of the video to like really get them to understand, like exactly what it is. And then also it needs to be disruptive, it needs to be scroll stopping, it needs to be eye and then also it needs to be uh, you know, at times controversial, um, and you know thing like if, if you can, if you have a video and there’s just something to just generate comments that sparks it, that that will really help. Because I’ve seen that a lot of the times that will correlate with a video going viral is people start commenting. And once people start commenting, then you know there’s more incentive for people to keep commenting because there’s already engagement, people are replying to each other’s messages, um, and then from there it’s like you’ve got sort of a method to go viral just organically with that.
Kevin King:
Now, are you just doing TikTok, or are you also doing like Instagram reels and YouTube shorts and that kind of stuff, or just primarily your focus is TikTok?
Tommy:
So my focus has always been TikTok, and so now, but now I’m doing full-service management, so I run a TSP, a TikTok shop partner agency, um. So I went through TikTok’s sort of course that they have, and I meet with TikTok twice a week and you know, big group setting, big group calls. Um, and so a short or a, a TSP has sort of five core, uh pillars, I guess, and so there’s short video management, there’s affiliate management, there’s shop operations and management, then there’s paid media and live video services, and so as a TSP I provide services for all of those pillars for clients that are trying to launch it on TikTok shop.
Kevin King:
So this is your own company or it’s in conjunction with TikTok?
Tommy:
This is my own company, yeah.
Kevin King:
Okay. So the meetings with TikTok are just to keep you up to date on the latest stuff and where you can ask questions about stuff. But then you’re you’ve got your own team or you’re jobbing out to people that are doing these five different core services.
Tommy:
Exactly, yeah, so the meetings with TikTok are sort of big group calls, educational calls. There’s one meeting a week that we have that’s like people will come and give presentations and they’ll be presenting the latest software to use or the different strategies that are working for them or fulfilled by TikTok, or whatever it is. And then there’s one call a week that’s like office hours and so I can come with my questions and we can sort of all collaborate as an industry almost.
Kevin King:
And does TikTok pay you for this, or is this just a privilege for you to help keep your agency stuff on the cutting edge?
Tommy:
Yeah, so TikTok does it all. It’s just a privilege that I get to to use that, and it’s all on Lark too, if you’re familiar with Lark um.
Kevin King:
Yeah, it’s an app.
Tommy:
Yeah, yeah, it’s, but it’s owned by Dance, and so it’s like um, and so they want all the TikTok people in there using it, and uh, it’s all sort of contained within that ecosystem.
Kevin King:
Yeah, it’s like Alibaba has their own little app ecosystem too. The Chinese like to control everything. They don’t want any outside stuff or someone’s coming in and scraping it. They want to have that complete control. So yeah, that makes sense. So when did the agency start?
Tommy:
Basically the start of 2023.
Kevin King:
Okay.
Tommy:
And so-
Kevin King:
You’ve been doing it about two and a half years.
Tommy:
Yeah, and you know it’s my LLC. I’ve been doing it, I mean because I’ve been in the business and it’s been a dream of mine for a long time, and then recently, and I’m still in that sort of building phase, but like things have been coming together in a beautiful, beautiful way. So, I’m excited to just keep keep going.
Kevin King:
So you’re working mostly with smaller like you were at an Amazon seller event, was that your first event to go to or you’ve been to others or were you there like just checking out the scene or hopefully recruiting clients, or what was your goal there?
Tommy:
Yeah, so I wasn’t sure at first. Um, it’s sort of funny, like the first event that I went to for cool content was um, expo west, the Natural Products Expo, and um, and I just happened to be, to be sort of in the right place. I’d gotten flown out for a YouTube video and I was hiking in Death Valley looking for a crashed airplane. And I get back to the apartment in North Hollywood and I get a message in that Lark group with like all the TikTok shop people. And this was when I had like just become an official TSP and they were like, oh, you know, if anyone’s around California, you’ve got to go to the Natural Products Expo. And so I went there. And then there was also an invite to the MDS event because they had a dinner out there at the same time, and so I went to all that. I met some of the people out there, and then a month goes by and everyone’s like, oh, you got to go out to Vegas, you got to go to Hit Prosper and Shop Talk and MDS. And I’m like, well, I guess I got to do it. So I, you know, dropped everything and flew out there and with no real goal other than like to just be there, I guess, and so I learned a lot ton of brilliant people that I got connected with, uh, got connected with you and um, and then I did you know a lot of people potential clients too that were out there.
Kevin King:
So so you went to both MDS and Prosper while you were out there, so that was your first exposure to like this Amazon kind of world?
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
Really Right. So, was it like overwhelming or was it like holy cow? There’s a lot going on here.
Tommy:
It was overwhelming. It was. Uh, there was. I remember, I think, like once I got back I even like made a LinkedIn post about this. I was like because when I, I guess, flew out there, I was thinking I was sort of like had a, like my, my ego got crushed while I was out there, because I was like thinking, okay, like I’m, I know TikTok, I know TikTok shop, I know all this stuff. And then I’m meeting all these people who, like they’ve just I mean part of it’s that they’ve been in the industry for longer and whatever but like just brilliant, brilliant people, and I’m like dang, like I was low-key, getting humbled, um, and so I was a little bit overwhelmed, especially like a couple days into it, and Vegas just takes everything out of you. I don’t know like what it is, but like if you’re just in Vegas for too long, then like it just sort of drains you, and so, like by the second or third day I was like, wow, I need to like put my head down and just like get to work, like use what I’m learning to deliver.
Kevin King:
So you went to some of the talks, like Michelle Barnum Smith or someone like that talking about TikTok and stuff, um, um, yeah, there’s, there’s several of them, uh, up there um.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
That’s so. What? What coming back out of that? What did you take out of that? Or what have you, or have you implemented anything from what you learned there, or whether that be something actually for your clients or that just something your, your way of thinking, or something that, what, what was the end result? Uh, now that you’re back and be able to digest what you, what you experienced there?
Tommy:
Yeah, um, I guess there’s, there are so many founders, so many brilliant people, so many people, all different levels. Part of it is connection, like I think for a long time I had been sort of just like, oh, I can do this on my own, I can just, I can make the videos go viral, I can scale my agency by myself, and it’s like that’s not, that’s not how that works, and I think I sort of had and I sort of knew that, but then I also didn’t really know, like where to find people, where to find other people who are also running a TikTok shop agency or you know, in the, in the industry. And then I think that that was really one of like the biggest things that like it revealed to me was like no, there’s people like you can, you can talk, you can have conversations that will like change your life in you know a room and you can be in a room full of people that you can have those conversations with. Um, so that was really like the biggest thing for me. And then also just sort of building these connections with people and really like it’s more than just business, you know, like it’s real human connection and like so many people driven, so many driven people trying to-
Kevin King:
It’s your type of people. It’s people that understand. They get you.
Tommy:
Yeah, exactly.
Kevin King:
They’re doing. They’re doing similar things or they’re in similar boats, so they’ve been through some of the same ups and downs that you might have been through. That’s an important aspect of it. So, what your clients now? What’s the name of the agency?
Tommy:
Cult Content.
Kevin King:
Cold Content.
Tommy:
Cult Content like a cult following.
Kevin King:
Oh, colt C-U-L-T. Yeah, so why that name? Oh, cult, cult c-u-l-t.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
So why? Why that name? Uh, does that, does that name? Like some people are like oh, what’s this? Like some guy, that’s uh the next, uh, uh, you know, Kevorkian or something, or what’s the next? Uh, you know, cult leader, or why the name Cult Content?
Tommy:
So, I’ve always been into like a the esoteric you know type of stuff. I’ve, I think, a you’re on TikTok shop. You need affiliates, you need your own cult. Essentially, to succeed on TikTok, you need affiliates who are under, dedicated to understanding your product, dedicated to posting right, and then, ultimately, you could think of your customers as an extension of your cult. I think that it fits sort of the TikTok social commerce world because you have to invest so much in like education and it’s not as transactional. If I was an Amazon agency and I was like, oh we’re gonna rank you, like I would, I would have a different name. But like, to succeed on TikTok, you need it to be like, authentic and you need people to really genuinely understand and share the same values as as like the product or like the brand, like what, what that represents, like you want people and affiliates to really double down and like, be passionate about that. Like you don’t want affiliates who are just going to like, you know, unbox the product and be like, oh, like whatever, like this, maybe this works, maybe it doesn’t, and that’s their video for you. You want people who are like in it they’re, they’re like a member of your cult.
Kevin King:
Yeah, yeah, the passion and all working towards a cause or something.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
Um, so so are you still doing videos now for in Cult Content yourself, or do you have like a team of people, affiliates, that are other creators, that kind of you? You send a lot of jobs off to.
Tommy:
Yeah, so generally the way that it works is a client will come in and we set up a budget, you know, for them, for affiliate retainers and that kind of thing, and then we set them up also with affiliate outreach tools. There’s a whole bunch of stuff that goes into the strategy, but no, I’m not I’m not the one making the videos, I’m more than one finding affiliates and so I have a Cult Content discord server that’s now got close to 100 members and you know affiliates are in there and they’ll have me, like, review their content and so I’ll sort of coach up affiliates and that kind of thing. Um, but generally it’s more equipping brands with the tools and the resources to find affiliates and then actually finding the affiliates and hiring them to create content.
Kevin King:
Are you finding them through software tools or just personal relationships and then referring each other? Because I think I saw something. There’s like 1.5 million people in the United States trying to make a living being a creator. Right now, every young kid doesn’t want to be a doctor or a fireman or astronaut anymore. They want to be a creator. And most of them are not making much money. I mean, you do have the ones that do very well, but the vast majority something like 98% make less than 10 grand a year off of it, and it’s so competitive. You go on to TikTok shop, into their portal and it’s like people are getting sometimes hundreds, if not thousands, of emails a day of people reaching out to them. You got agencies, you got all these different tools and all these companies have propped up to help place people. It’s both competitive. It’s competitive and there’s a lot of noise. So how do you, how do you stand, how do you recruit or what do you do to get these hundred plus people that are on the discord I’m assuming you probably have a few more than that that just aren’t on the discord?
Tommy:
Yeah, yeah, I mean, we’ve got thousands. Generally, if you want engagement, what I’ve seen works is offering some kind, some kind of a higher incentive. Whether that’s some kind of a higher incentive, whether that’s basically saying, hey, and we also have the opportunity to earn a retainer or a paper video deal, join this discord and, and you know, let’s get to work. That kind of thing. The way that I see affiliates and I guess, like this whole sort of ecosystem, right, because it is incredibly competitive and as an agency, you have to, you have to balance a lot right. You have to balance the client and they’re trying to obviously sell as much product for the lowest you know cost to acquire that business. And then you’ve got the affiliates right and you have the affiliates that are having their issues, where a lot of them maybe they’re new they just don’t know how the game works and what type of content they should be making, and that kind of thing.
Tommy:
You’ve got people who are more established but they still have super fluctuating income and so because as an affiliate, you might make $15,000 one month and $2,000 the next, or it’s not a stable income, and so you have to really try to understand the goals of each affiliate, and I like to meet with them, talk face to face and be like hey, like what are you know? What are you really trying to do? What are your goals? How can I help you? And if the client has budget for, uh, retainers and I think that an affiliate is a is a good fit and they’re going to do a good job, make good content, especially if they have sort of a proven track record of driving sales, and that’s one way that you know I can help them out and um, so it’s really just sort of like navigating all these, all these different relationships with affiliates and clients and figuring out a way to make it work for everyone.
Kevin King:
How do you screen them because a lot of people you, I can send my products to anybody and anybody can almost create a video. I mean some people are better at editing or lighting or whatever, um, but a lot of times it takes a salesman. I mean, you got to actually know sales and marketing and how to trigger people into buying. I mean, if you’ve got a hot, trending product, anybody can almost sell that. But if I, if I’m trying to sell something that’s maybe not so hot and trending, but convince people to do it, what do you look for in these creators that actually shows you that they can sell? Is it a track record on Kalo data? But that means you’re eliminating the new people that might actually be good, or they don’t get a chance. Or how do you filter them? Like, all right, you look like you’re good on camera and you can actually sell.
Tommy:
Right. So the two main things that you look at and this is partially just because that’s what this is, what TikTok presents to you, right, they, before a product sample goes out, unless it’s set to auto approve, you have to approve the product samples, and so you’re looking at the post right, and you’re looking at the gross metric, or gross merchandise value, the GMV. And so if an affiliate has over $1,000 in GMV, they’re probably going to be like okay, maybe I can actually take this a little bit more seriously. As opposed to someone who has no GMV, they might just be in it for the product sample. Obviously, someone with $80,000 in GMV over the last 30 days you might have to, you know, pay some money as well to get the content going, but that’s really your best bet is like, okay, have you generated revenue before? There are affiliates you know who don’t have as much GMV, but you meet with them and you get a feel for, honestly, it’s sort of like an intellect thing, right, where it’s like okay, you know how to make content, you’re coachable, like I can tell that you’re you. You match the ICP of the, of what the client’s looking for, as in a customer. So, yeah, there’s definitely a lot that you can look for in an affiliate to make it work, but ultimately, too, it just comes back to the numbers. We’re going to pay the affiliates who make us the most money, and we’re going to try to train anyone and get them to become that affiliate as well, because they have to have that buy-in.
Kevin King:
What do you do to set expectations of the clients? Sometimes the clients will come in and they’re like they want a magic pill. They want like, oh, make this. Every video should go viral. Every video should make me X amount of money. What do you do to set the expectations on clients?
Tommy:
Yeah, so I have a profitability calculator that I use and like, generally too, there’s, TikTok is an investment, right, you’re, you’re buying into the platform, you’re buying into, like, the whole ecosystem, and you have to understand that it is a long term game, because you’re, like, there’s so much top of funnel awareness that comes with TikTok as a platform, um, and it is expensive, and so I do have to set that expectation, um, as well as like there’s certain clients that that it just wouldn’t be good for right, like, if you don’t have the finances to really invest in TikTok and to make it work, then don’t. You know, don’t do it but generally to like you have to like explain to them in someway that there is a level of like randomness to this where you, in some ways, are waiting for a video to go viral, or waiting for, you know, some ads to start converting to the point where they can scale and there’s, we can put all of the strategy behind it and we can figure out so much of like, what needs to be done to like make that happen, but at a at a certain point, we are still just waiting for it to happen and then, once it goes, you know, having all the systems in place to just keep it going.
Tommy:
Um, that’s sort of the, the methodology there. But in terms of managing expectations, it’s just sort of like you got to keep it real, you know, get it like if I don’t want, I don’t want anyone to think that like, oh, I’m going to sign up with cool content and first month I’m going to make fifty thousand dollars, because that’s just unless, unless we’re doing a lot, then we’re not, we’re not pulling those kind of numbers right out the gate, you know.
Kevin King:
So what makes Cult Content better than somebody else? if I’m looking for someone to help me out, I’m a seller. Listening to this um on an AM/PM podcast and I’m like, yeah, I want to get in this TikTok, but you know I don’t have time or I don’t want to mess with it, just let someone do it. Why, what? Why should they consider you guys over? Uh, about two million other possibilities out there? I’m exaggerating, there’s not 2 million, but a lot of other possibilities.
Tommy:
Yeah. So I think a lot of it comes down to just like I eat, sleep and breathe TikTok, and I know a lot of people do that. But I also I’m very transparent. I will always sort of say how it is with a client. I will always be as clear as possible. I’ll always like if, if it’s not a right fit, I’ll let them know. Like I think, um, the what makes Cult Content different is just that part of it is just my, my experience in like I’ve been breathing this like it has been my life for like so, uh, for a while, and it’s like, honestly, I’ve built my brain to make it uh, you know, make, make cool content, like be what it is and, um, I’m just very committed to it, working for my clients as well. Like there’s not a I like all of my clients I consider almost like friends, sort of like getting back to what we were saying about how going out to like prosper, you’ve got like like there’s an MDS, you, you form this connection and I’m big on that. Like I’m big on fulfilling the mission of my clients, like if you, if you’ve got a supplement that you think really, really helps people and you’re passionate about that then, like when you work with Cult Content, your mission becomes our mission and like we are, like, like that’s why, that’s why I’m doing it, like that’s why we’re, we’re in it, you know.
Kevin King:
What’s your creative process like? So, I’m a client with a supplement. I come to you and say hey, um I want you, I want you to take care of this for me, Tommy. Um, here’s my, here’s my creatine powder. Um, what do you? What do you do next?
Tommy:
So I mean, first, we, we have to find the differentiators of the product between like what it? You know there’s a million other creatine products out there. So, like what is it about this creatine that is actually, you know, going to get people to buy, and like, who is the who is the client looking for? Like some clients, they know exactly who their core customer is, um, and they can share that with me, and that’s always nice. But if not, like that’s sort of what I’m going to be thinking about is like who is who is it that like this is actually solving problems for? And how do we reach that person? Because if you’re not, if you’re not doing that as like your first step, then everything else can just be sort of pointless, and so that’s sort of like where that that first step comes in. And then from there it’s like it becomes about, you know, content and angles and hooks, and I’m not like as involved in making the videos anymore and a lot of it is going to be like, honestly, if it’s for like a brand new client, and I’m trying to get them launched as fast as possible. I’ll use ChatGPT for scripting and just finding some of that, like those angles that are going to work. And then from there I take that and we, we create a whole bunch of scripts and we distribute those to affiliates and, you know, put those in a system where they can be used by affiliates so that they can leverage that content or that, those scripts and those angles.
Kevin King:
How much should someone be willing to spend, say, it’s not a big company, and they’re like I want to try this out and I just want to see if my product fits on the TikTok and if we can make this work. Is this a couple thousand bucks? Is it 5,000 bucks by the time you pay your agency’s fees? The affiliates, um, any kind of creative stuff that’s got to be created, and maybe even put a little bit of advertising behind the ones that work. What, what am I looking at? Just to do a solid little test on not a not on a big budget.
Tommy:
Right, generally, uh, you’d be looking at spending like 10 grand a month after everything’s said and done product samples, shipping, affiliate retainers. I like to do a product launch campaign as well. So I’ll use a platform like Sellico. Client has like a control over their distribution. Then I like to literally place the orders, the initial orders, so that, because that’s one of the first things that a customer or an affiliate sees with a product is how many units have been sold. So there’s a lot that goes into the launch and generally, you’re looking at spending anywhere between like seven to 10 grand a month after all is said and done.
Kevin King:
And then that includes the cost of the product samples that you’re giving out and the shipping and everything.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
And that includes your agency’s fees, because you I’m basically, if I’m the client, I’m paying you, and then you’re paying the affiliates, you’re negotiating the commissions with the affiliates and you’re taking a little Scooby snack off the top, or however that works right.
Tommy:
Yeah, we charge an agency fee, and so then, um, we charge an agency and a percentage, typically. Um, and then we, but we have budget for affiliate retainers, and so we’ll go through that with a client and be like this is what we’re going to set, we’re going to spend $2,000 or whatever it is, on affiliate budgets or affiliate retainers or paper video deals.
Kevin King:
But that wouldn’t include Performance Max or whatever they call it, or Spark.
Tommy:
Ads the GMV Max, yeah, so that’s.
Kevin King:
Performance Max is. Google, not GMV Max.
Tommy:
Yeah, so that wouldn’t include GMV Max and generally too, I don’t like to really start ads. If someone was just launching, we wouldn’t be running ads month one. So we’re looking more at running ads once we’ve already got a good base of content.
Kevin King:
Once you get something proven.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
What does Sellico do in that process for you?
Tommy:
So Sellico is a platform that I use to. They have a TikTok shop launchpad and essentially what you can do is you can set it up so that they have a list of. However, I think like several hundred thousand customers who will go to your TikTok shop and they’ll either click on a link that we provide that’s like from an affiliate video or you could do it like right from the shop page. They’ll order the product through TikTok shop and then 40 to 60% of them- will leave a review. So Salico facilitates-
Kevin King:
On TikTok shop.
Tommy:
Yeah, so Salico facilitates that interaction with however many orders you want to go through, and so what that does is you’ve got now, you know, 50 people order the product. Some of that money that you invested obviously will circle back through, and you’ve got people even leaving reviews. It’s something to get uh traction started on TikTok shop. Otherwise-
Kevin King:
Basically a trust. So when someone sees your affiliates video, they go to the TikTok shop to buy the product. There’s not zero reviews there, there’s-
Tommy:
Exactly yes.
Kevin King:
Is there are certain numbers that are magic, like on Amazon. Uh, statistically people say the magic number is 21. Once you get 21 reviews, people will start believing um, that that it’s legit. You know, if there’s three there and they’re all five star, people are like yeah, it’s not enough. Not enough sample size, not enough people. Is there a number on TikTok where you see like, um, you need to get, you recommend your clients get 20 or 30 or 50 or some number to really help on their conversions?
Tommy:
Um, I haven’t heard a number for the um reviews, but generally I’ve heard like ten thousand dollars a month in sales is when people will start to see traction, like things start moving a little bit easier. Um-
Kevin King:
So I’m wondering, like so how does a new person break in on TikTok if someone has zero GMV? Let’s say me, I’m not selling on TikTok. Let’s say, all of a sudden I want to be a affiliate on TikTok. Like, hey, I can sell some stuff on TikTok. I’ve done this for a little bit. I’m an old guy, I know what to do. I’ve been around the block. I want to get paid. I go up there and I put my listing up or register on TikTok and all this stuff. I have zero GMV. You said that’s a gut feeling. If I get on the phone with you, like all right, I’m going to give this guy a chance. But a lot of people don’t even do that. They just filter them out. So those people, what do they do to get a start? Do they go to silicone and become a buyer so that they actually, through their own link or something and like now I got a little bit of GMV? Or is there a system or someone that’s helping these new people kind of get their foot in the door?
Tommy:
So are you, are you talking about for um as an affiliate, or do you mean, like, as someone launching a brand?
Kevin King:
Both, I mean, I guess it goes both ways, because the affiliates also don’t want to work with a brand that has zero GMV.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
And the brands don’t want to work with some affiliate that has zero, so it goes both ways. So how do you get that initial wheel pumping so people can get going?
Tommy:
Yeah. So that’s, I mean, that’s where the platform Sellico comes in, right, where it’s like you have to have some kind of group buy-in and show like, okay, there’s traction behind this product. Both an affiliate needs to see that in order for them to want to work with the product and the customer needs to see that too in order to trust it and make that purchase. So if you’re not going to use Sellico, the other I guess method would be to literally place the order yourself and then have your distributor send only one product. I don’t know how long this method will work for, because I think, I mean, from what I’ve heard, no one’s gotten slapped for this. I know that this was a thing that was going on Amazon for a while and then I guess they had to, uh, sort of regulate that. But you can literally just order 100 units on TikTok shop and then have your distributor only ship one product and then from there at least, you’ve got 100 units sold showing up, um, and that’s sort of a place to start.
Kevin King:
So basically, the bottom line is people are gaming a little bit to get going on just like they used to do. I mean it’s common in every industry. I mean Airbnb, when they first launched. They game the Reddit system and the referral system. I mean everybody. It’s kind of a known thing at Amazon. You’re right, Amazon cracked down on it back when I back in 2016, 2016, when you were still in middle school- I guess you could actually launch on it. You could get reviews on Amazon. You could give away a product for free and it was permissible for the person to come and leave a review as long as they put a disclaimer that said I received this product in exchange for my honest opinion, or something like that.
Tommy:
Yeah.
Kevin King:
That became an issue and Amazon banned that in November of 2016, or October sorry, October of 2016. And then another industry popped up of search, find, buy, where you would pay agencies. They would see which keywords you need to rank on. They had an audience of people. You would then go and pay them, say, $15. If it was a supplement, it could be 20 bucks, $20 per buy that was the agency’s fee and then they would get their buyers to go in search for a certain keyword, scroll up and down, click around a little bit and then go buy your product off of that keyword. So, it got attributed and then you had to pay the agency for that too. So, if it’s a $30 product, you’re giving $45 for every spot supplement bottle sold to the agency. Now you’re getting some of that back. Just like you said, it circles back through and you get you know, after Amazon’s fees, you’re going to get half or more of that back, like 20, 25 bucks that back. So, it’s still costing you $30 or something per sale and that’s how people were ranking. And then Amazon cracked down on that and then it became a search, find, buy and a rebate thing. And that’s where the guys at MDS one of the co-founders of MDS had a company called Rebate Key, and so they’re like well, rebates have been legal since the dawn of commerce, so if you buy something, I can give you a rebate. We’ll make it official. We’re not just Amazon, we’re a Walmart and everywhere else, and that was the way for a while and then Amazon cracked down on that and now there’s still something.
Kevin King:
Now the methodology on Amazon primarily is product feedback. So instead of getting this product in exchange for a review, or getting this product and just go search on a keyword, they actually want you to actually get the product, buy the product actually. Then give critical, not on Amazon, but like to the service provider. You give critical advice and so you say oh yeah, I think you know this is a needs to adjust here, or I didn’t like this part of it, or whatever, and you give this like. You shoot a video of you scrolling around the screen looking at the listing and all this kind of stuff, and so they’re couching it as markets, market research, and so it’s just it’s. You know, you’re putting lipstick on a pig and just changing the way, but it’s the same thing. So that’s what I was curious about. So you’re saying that that same kind of a similar type of thing is happening on TikTok as well.
Tommy:
Absolutely yeah, yeah and it sounds like it sounds like TikTok is a little bit more receptive to it. Yeah, right now, because a lot of times when, when, when marketplaces are newer, they’re a little more forgiving because they know they need to get the flywheel going. So Amazon kind of looked the other way for the first few years, and then the FTC, some story came out and they’re like oh, we gotta, we’re a public company, we gotta behave a little bit more. So they, they tighten it and then they keep tightening a little bit, as they don’t need that anymore. They got enough people in the system. So that’s probably TikTok is probably uh, they’re probably, they know what’s happening, uh, and may at some point crack down, but right now they’re like you know what it’s, it’s helping get the ball going. So we’re, we’re, we’re cool with, as long as it doesn’t get out of hand.
Tommy:
Yeah, and I think too it’s, you know it’s. It’s an interesting thing too, cause it’s like it has to do partially with the buyer’s trust of the platform where, like they’re not, they’re not really TikTok shop is still new and some people they’re fine, making those purchases. A lot of people are a little bit more hesitant-
Kevin King:
Hesitant to buy the product.
Tommy:
Especially when a product yeah yeah, exactly, and so, especially when a product has no sales, they’re going to be like uh, no, thanks, and so, and the fact that that it’s just so visible, like it’s right there on the product page, you know, when you look at a product on TikTok shop, and so that’s something that I think is, you know, it’s important to do, and like for a while I underestimated the importance of it and I was like, oh well, like you know, if we get enough of affiliates and we get them making content, you know, surely some of them are going to drive a bunch of sales and stuff, but like it’ll be so much easier for the affiliates to get sales if you’ve already got sales and if there’s already traction there. So something to spark it definitely, definitely really helps.
Kevin King:
Yeah, I know I don’t know if most of your clients also have a presence on Amazon. I know you have to be careful in promoting go buy this on Amazon and TikTok stuff. There’s certain things you can’t do but a lot of them are just going to go naturally search for the brand on Amazon. I know several brands that say they do okay on TikTok shop and they’re getting a lot of views, but as soon as they start running their TikTok videos or something goes viral, they see a huge uptick on Amazon. I think there’s been some studies that say about 60 to 70% of the sales that you make off of a TikTok campaign are actually not going to come on TikTok shop. They’re going to come on Amazon for that exact reason you said the trust issue. And people know that if I buy it on Amazon, my credit card is already there. I don’t have to. It’s easy to return. I can depend on it showing up in a day or two.
Tommy:
You get your free shipping. Yeah.
Kevin King:
You get your free shipping. You get all that.
Tommy:
You are on Prime.
Kevin King:
Yeah, on TikTok shop. The beauty is you can just I’ve bought some things on TikTok shop. As you’re scrolling, something comes across that’s of interest to you. You’re like, you like it. You hit a couple of buttons, uh and boom, uh it’s, it’s on its way to you and you’re back to scrolling instantly. Yeah, it’s very it’s very uh, very insular there, so you’re not like having to bounce off and like where was I in the scroll? Or you get, uh, you know you get distracted. It’s like boom, boom, boom, close that window, you’re back right where you were and keep, keep scrolling on, and that that’s the beauty of social, uh, social shopping.
Tommy:
Yeah, I mean it’s amazing, like how well contained it is within the platform and, and I guess, to your point too, where it’s like you have so much of this like the halo effect and people going to Amazon to make that purchase um and so then it’s like you’re the investment that you’re making into TikTok and that’s why I talk about like top of funnel awareness, like and it’s so important because there’s no other platform that you can do this with right, where you can invest in the platform and have it pay back, not just instant like, like through TikTok shop, but then also through Amazon and through your site, like there’s, and to the scale that you can do it with TikTok shop, like if you can, you can have a video about your product that’s just talking about how it solves a problem. Go viral, reach millions of people and inform millions of people who have now, like, they’ve entered the top of your funnel right. You, those impressions will convert. It might take a couple weeks, it might you know they they’re only x amount, are gonna click on the product page and get retargeted and whatever, but like you have this massive opportunity for just huge top of funnel awareness and then you know from there, like, if you, if you’re set up on Amazon, good like, because you’re going to see that that increase so.
Kevin King:
Lots of opportunity out there. Man, you’re in the right place at the right time. Uh, from pallets to buses. Uh, you still have the bus?
Tommy:
I do still have the bus.
Kevin King:
Yeah, you still have all right. That’s awesome, man. You have to do the TikTok bus tour at some point.
Tommy:
Exactly, exactly. It’s on there, it’s on my page somewhere.
Kevin King:
Take to get a sponsor to pay for a cross-country a TikTok tour with affiliates.
Tommy:
Sounds great to me passing out samples, uh, all along the way, and hosting little get-togethers for the cults all along, little cult parties all the way along Route 66 or something like that. That would be cool.
Tommy:
Yeah, that sounds like a fun time.
Kevin King:
Well, Tommy, if people want to reach out to Cult Content or to follow you or get in touch with you or something, how would they go about doing that?
Tommy:
Yeah, so on socials, if you just look up Tommy Lynch, look for the ginger. I should be there, otherwise email me, [email protected]. Check out my website, cultcontent.cc, and yeah that’s probably the best way to do it. LinkedIn, too.
Kevin King:
Always LinkedIn for business, that’s right. Well, Tommy, I really appreciate you coming on today. This has been great. Thanks for joining.
Tommy:
Thank you, Kevin. Thanks for having me.
Kevin King:
I know it’s like your third podcast that you’ve done. How was it?
Tommy:
Dude, this was pretty good. This was my favorite one so far.
Kevin King:
All right.
Tommy:
It’s hard to get into it.
Kevin King:
All right. It’s going to be your favorite one of all time. You’re going to do like a hundred more as you become more popular and more famous uh but you’re going to go AM/PM one. That was like man, that was cool. Uh, appreciate you coming on, man.
Tommy:
Thank you, Kevin, I appreciate it. Thanks for having me.
Kevin King:
Social commerce is playing a bigger and bigger role in selling online, as you can see, in this world with AI and marketplaces, social commerce is an important element that you need to have in your mix if you’re selling products, whether that’s on Amazon or Walmart or your own shop or wherever it may be. You don’t have to be on Amazon or Walmart to do well on TikTok shop. We just had on the Marketing Misfits podcast Tammy Iveloski. She’s doing 21 plus million a year on TikTok shop with zero presence on Amazon. So if you want a different side of things, go check out that podcast as well. I think you’ll learn something. You can always learn something, too in the Billion Dollar Sellers newsletter. Billiondollarsellers.com is the website to actually go to. It’s free every Monday and Thursday. You know what else is free is the AM/PM podcast. We’ll be back again next Thursday with another awesome episode. So if you like this episode, feel free to like it, to subscribe to the channel whether it’s Apple podcast or Spotify or you’re watching this on YouTube and forward this to a friend if you think they’ll get some value from it. Otherwise, I will see you again next week right here.
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